Well... turds.

[stoney321]

I hate seeing all of these posts about people leaving LJ. For the record, I'm not leaving. I have a frickin' permanent account, and I'm going to use every penny of it, you know? What I am going to do is double post here and at Greatest Journal (GJ) where I am stoney321. Let me know if you're over there and I don't have you friended.

Also, I'm not going to move to loads of sites, like I see people doing. Guys, I'm getting too old for this shit. [/every buddy cop movie made] I have Semagic and I've heard that you can do double posting, so I'm looking into that. I found the LJ backup tool, ljArchive, incredibly simple to use - plus, it has a search device that rocks. (You can find anything from a random comment with ___ topic, etc. etc.)

As for the banhammer controversy, look. I personally do not find those images hot, a turn on, whatever. But you know what? I find Will Ferrell hot, and people look at me like I'm a freak, so... :D I've written Anna Nicole Smith/Daniel fic - I have no room to talk, I believe. My glass house is lovely, and there will be no rocks thrown. I do feel, however, that 6A has the right to run their business as they see fit. That's just the name of the game. (And considering that MySpace found tens of THOUSANDS of pedophiles on their servers... I can see why 6A is acting as they are, whether we like it or not. And whether there is an actual threat there, which, statistically, there isn't: .02% of the profiles were offenders, isn't something 6A/LJ is concerned with.) They just need to be UPFRONT about their WANTS.

I'm not going to talk about what has merit, etc. I think the REAL issue (and one the 6A/LJ is doing a crap job of saying) is that this is about what a COMPANY wants on their equipment, period. If they're going public (and I bet you diamonds to donuts they are and I am jumping on that IPO like it's 1999 - ahahaha, um, anyone get that? Stock/IPO boom?) they want to cater to the potential stock holders. Like it or hate it, that's the situation (from their standpoint) as I see it.

And you know, if you have something that you think might be questionable? Put it behind a lock. That's such a simple solution, imo (Thank you, Maren for saying it so succinctly.) I've locked my fic that could fall under "questionable" and it will remain that way. If someone isn't 18, they aren't going to be on my flist, period. [ETA] Evidently that may not matter? *head desk*

And those are my thoughts on yaoi the sitch.

[ETA 2]

For the record: I think that LJ/6A is handling this all badly. I've posted about that before, but I wanted to clarify. I feel that warning should be given, that a COMPLETE and CONCISE explanation on all the LJ-run comms to insure everyone sees the new policy shoudl be done.

Also: I've gone to this post to find out how to configure Semagic to post to multiple journals at once. It took me a bit and I found the following helpful:

1. Make sure you have the latest version of Semagic
2. Make sure on the login screen (the first thing that pops up) is your NORMAL username.
3. When you click "File, Server Settings," DO NOT put the addendum (lj or gj or ij whatever) in your username THERE.
4. On the INITIAL LOG IN SCREEN, add stoney321 gj (your username, obv.) and it will go through.
5. When you're ready to post, hit "journal, post to multiple journals" and you should see the normal livejournal login and the new gj log in. Voila!

NIFTY!

Comments

[draconin.livejournal.com]

I feel pretty much the same way. I can see why some people are getting hot under the collar but it's just not lighting my fire. Have you seen the comment by synecdochic here (http://synecdochic.livejournal.com/147625.html)? It's a great deal more balanced than a lot of the postings I've been seeing.

[dwivian]

Before you bring up MySpace.... realize their purge, compared to their total user base, meant that MySpace had fewer pedophiles than the general population. Seems it would be safer to send your kids there than to the local grocery store...

Locked fic and pics WERE NOT SAFE. A journal has already been suspended, even though the information was LOCKED. That doesn't work. If you want to be safe, you will have to leave LJ for someplace that likes their users and isn't interested in paying lipservice to their TOS.

I can *NOT* see why 6A is acting like they are -- they reviewed an art piece between OF AGE people, not child pornography at all, and deemed it to NOT BE ART, despite it being created by a professional artist that is good enough to be invited to OTHER COUNTRIES for her work.

I am certain this is about removing controversial information from their servers in advance of an IPO attempt. I will do my best to join every forum where such things are discussed to spread the press of just how 6A/LJ treats customers, and that stockholders should expect similar treatment, and investment would be a poor decision. That's how strongly I feel about their actions.

I also feel this is an outgrowth of fear at 6A in the conservative US government, as they claim to be using the Miller test, but aren't using a community standard to validate art. They are becoming a dictatorship, which is NOT a valid business model if they want public ownership. Nor is it valid for a business that opens its doors to anyone that wants to create a journal.

[dwivian]

you do know she works for LJ, right?

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

I did NOT know that! Huh. I had seen her post and thought, "my goodness. What a calm statement. Hmm."

Well. Now it makes sense.

[dwivian]

Elfgirl just correct me.... she's given notice, but she was an employee before, so she'll have insight into the other side, and has a vested interest in keeping her employee referral positive and not neutral... I'd still see it with a biased eye.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Oh, sure - that's why I put the "statistically, only .02% of their profiles were actually pedophiles" comment - but for investors, all they'll think about is "29,000?!? My god, Marge! We've got to DO something!" you know?

I just saw your wife's post about how locked pics/fic aren't any safer and added an ETA. GAH. That changes things for me - I'm definitely leaving things here (I'm sure not all of my flist will leave), but moving to other sites just in case. I don't typically post stuff that's questionable (except for my wacky sense of humor, har har) but this little "Crucible" button they're adding to every post? Yeah. It'll work out as well now as it did in 1600s Salem. o_0

This is definitely a knee-jerk reaction on LJ's part. It seems so opposite to what they used to be/represent. I think they're about to have a rude awakening from their clientelle leaving en masse.

[illcoveryou-x.livejournal.com]

OMG I am at GJ too! I am illcoveryou

Boy, we sure do branch away from LJ user names, huh?

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Oh, that's good to know, both her previous connection and current connection. Thanks for letting me know.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Ahahaha. It's just easier, you know? :D

[that_mireille]

The locking "may not matter" in the sense that flocked posts can still get you suspended, but someone has to report it to LJ Abuse in the first place. Which means someone has to be able to *see* it. (Also, just because the user had a flocked journal--posting to an unlocked *community* means that more people will see it. And some of those people may be asshats who report your fic/art/whatever.)

So while locking may not guarantee safety, it can only help.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

I've been informed that locked posts may not matter - and you bring up a GOOD POINT: if it's your journal, and it's flocked... Someone on your flist reported you. Man, talk about treachery. The comms? You don't really have control over, so there goes any "safe haven" for groups. (As we've seen with that kerfuffle over at BadBuffyFic where people joined just to rat out people.)

The ugliness is just breathtaking, right? (I still hold to the opinion that if you think it's questionable, flock. You're right: it can only help.)

[that_mireille]

I never thought that flocking was a guarantee of safety. Ever. What I did think was, "Well, I am now showing this only to people I already decided were trustworthy, so I can feel safeR that it will not be reported."

But I have a lot of unpopular opinions about this, including the fact that the problem is LJ's craptacular communications/customer service and lack of an appeals process, and not the fact that (possibly even, if some of the posts I've read are correct, at the request of the copyright holders) LJ has deleted two journals.

(Of course, I am also not freaking out at the "report abuse" link, mostly because there have been times when I wished it was easier to find (not because of smutty fanworks). So my judgment is apparently highly suspect.)

[justhuman.livejournal.com]

I just put up a post in my journal (http://justhuman.livejournal.com/319500.html) providing links to backup services and instructions. For Semagic, take a look towards the bottom of the post in "Step 4" -- Snapetoy on GJ posted a set of instructions on how to configure to post to multple journals.

You might be interested in "Step 3" too. There's another tool, LJ-Sec, that has two important functions. It allows you to easily change the security on any LJ (or LJ clone) post. It also allows you to repost any or all of your LJ entries to one of the clone services. I copied my entire journal over to GJ, IJ and JF. Then I started cross posting to all 4 services using Semagic.

You don't get the comments, which is unpleasant, but it is a way to save all posts.

I'm Justhuman everywhere, in case your looking, and I just friended you on GJ.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Your first paragraph: YES. Which is why I have varying levels of flock, depending on what's being typed. :D

And you know, I think that my thoughts on all of this are about the same as yours. I don't like the way LJ HANDLED it. The pictures in question? Um, they bothered me. A lot. (But then, I'm the person that hates Lolita without reservation and find it to be incredibly upsetting, so. I'm mostly alone on that one.)

It would have been better if LJ said, "We will give you 24 hours (or whatever) to remove such and such image to offsite/from our servers. Any further postings of similar material/copyright infringement will result in blah blah blah." Them just doing it, then telling them they've done something irrevocable is wrong, imo.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

THANK YOU for those links - that's very helpful. And I'm off to return in kind!

[sweetumms33.livejournal.com]

I'm so very confused...is this the backlash of the LJ strikeout from a few months ago, or is this just a continuation of the problem? Is there going to be a mass exodus to GJ? I never actually know about the politics here until I read from you.

I still think its frightening that they are explicit in what constitutes at child pornography. All those Snape/Harry shippers out there are technically doing something wrong, yet I don't think I would know that had I not seen your post

[that_mireille]

At least with text, there is a possibility of putting it down (hitting the back button, etc.) without actually reading anything upsetting. With pictures, you really can't.

Now, I am *totally* okay with the artists choosing to draw them (or with people choosing to write the fic). It's all imaginary, after all.

I'm also okay with LJ/6A deciding, "not on OUR servers, you don't." But they definitely need to *handle things better.*

And fandom needs to start remembering, "hey, maybe we *should* be a little more aware that people who Don't Get It are watching us."

[darlas-mom.livejournal.com]

I just had a whole long comment on Fod's journal related to the chan thing, which used words like "psychology" a lot. It ain't my cup of tea, either--not by a long shot (I couldn't get past the first two or three chapters in "Lolita" myself, and I got very viscerally uncomfortable at the stuff implied in "A:ts" S2's "Untouched") but I'm basically of that whole "I don't agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" school of thought.

I'm really not cool with what LJ's doing, how they're handling stuff, and the fact that they'll delete, purge and permanently ban users who actually FLOCK their stuff really annoys me. And the fact that people are being turned in by their own flists--it's a batshit crazy time. It is not at all cool.

I'm on GJ and IJ under the same name, if you're interested. Also, fandom_flies is a comm devoted to organizing a server all 34,000+ of us who joined fandom_counts could look at as a new, fan-safe home. (It's really cool so far, actually--they're working on scripts already to automatically copy your entries and comments off of LJ)

Also, I am totally willing to host any images/fic people off my flist might be considered about at my domain, cityofdemons.com (http://cityofdemons.com). LJ has a thing in their TOS that says they're not responsible for off-LJ stuff people link to.

[darlas-mom.livejournal.com]

...er. That's stuff people might be concerned about. Ignore my crazy fingers, they know not what they do.

[julia-here.livejournal.com]

As you can probably tell, I've been watching this situation since it first hit the news comment thread; somewhere over at JF I said something about my committment to artistic freedom going down every time the macro with the picture at issue was used. It's not my thing- not the subject matter, and not the style of illustration- and I don't want to see it unwarned. Or, like, at all, ever.

But, I don't want it mislabeled as child porn and the artist put on a sex offendors list, either. There's already too much damage being done- both to people assigned to the list for trivialities but more importantly to society's ability to distinguish between really dangerous people and those who have sublimated their dangerous urges sufficiently not to hurt anyone (by this I am absolutely excluding photographic/video porn). Muddying the waters about the nature and danger of the offense just makes it harder to pay attention to the actual human victims, who get the least attention of all.

There was a bit of by-play earlier this week about the difference between being catty in private and in public, which maybe is relevant here: there are times and places to let our anti-social yayas out, and refusing to recognize that distinction is probably a manifestation of the death wish.

Julia, my manifestation of the death wish, today, has to do with going to a Polish wedding and eating a little of everything.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

This is basically a resurfacing of Strikethrough - I don't have all the links because it's exhausting. You can find about it - and all the info - on fandom_wank, which is in my links list. It's the first thing that comes up.

One of the pictures in question involved an 11 year old Harry (first year at Hogwarts) and Snape's... leavings. On Harry's face. Some people dig that, fine. I don't, but I don't see why the artist can't post it off site and link to it. That seems fair to me, but then, my journal wasn't deleted without a by your leave like that artist's was. *shrug*

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

I think things should be handled differently, absolutely. And I also am of the opinion that flocks should be allowed, and users under a certain age cannot have a profile, etc.

And your last paragraph: YES. Just put the stuff off site, and link to it. That seems so simple to me, but I get that people want to have everything in one spot. Gah. This whole thing.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Is there a possibility that the artist could be put on a sex offender's list for that image? WOW. That seems crazy to me! Now, to be fair, I was of the opinion back in the day that drawings weren't the same as photos. (I mean, come on, right?)

It seems like a bandaid to NOT HELP people who really are victims. I get the strong suspicion that the mindset (once 6A has everything in its place) will be, "mischief managed." And that will be it. And... that's not really stopping/helping people who are abusers or will be.

It's all just such ugliness. GAH.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Agreed. To everything you've said. Why is that difficult to grasp or get behind? I don't understand why that's a problem.

[beer-good-foamy.livejournal.com]

As far as I'm concerned, the problem isn't so much that LJ makes up its own rules - they are completely within their right to do so - but that those rules are so vague, contradictory and seemingly arbitrary. jupiter_star has a pretty good round-up here (http://jupiter-star.livejournal.com/368741.html) of what LJ have said and done, and it's... confusing, to say the least. Fiction journals need not fear, but fiction journals may be deleted. Everyone will get an advance warning, but you'll get no advance warning. Fiction and created images are safe, but only if the LJ staff feel that they have "serious artistic merit" (whatever that is). If LJ want to ban descriptions of underage sex in all forms, or slash, or whatever - that's their prerogative, but people must have a sporting chance of knowing beforehand whether a certain fic or image might get them deleted or banned with no chance to defend themselves.