Allow me to stick my neck out.

[stoney321]

This woman ought to be beat over the head with a large stick. You know what pisses me off about a lot of these "born again" Christians? The fact that they don't know dick about Jesus. (And I would love a t-shirt or bumper sticker that read "You don't know dick about Jesus." I predict that would be a big seller.) If you are a Christian (and please, spare me the "Christians are being persecuted b.s. They aren't. They're being questioned and challenged on some beliefs, which does not translate into persecution) that means that you aspire to be Christ-like. Not Paul-like, not Solomon-like, not King David-like.

Instead of focusing on the words of the woman-hating Apostle Paul, how about focusing on what JESUS said? Because, my guess? And I'm going out on a limb here, Christianity is actually based on Jesus, not the other schleps. I know, I know, crazy talk. For those of you doing it right? Good for you. For those of you not? Allow me.

Spare the rod, spoil the child, blah blah blah. Are you seriously going to model your life after a mindset more than 2000 years old, when people didn't think there was anything wrong with having women be beneath the importance of livestock? The glory of God is intelligence, people, and our brains were designed to grow and evolve. Anyhoodle....

Jesus' stance on how to treat children, and imo, THIS does away with the whole OT training on child-rearing. Which, you know, Jesus himself said (atheists, bear with me) that He came to bring about a new law.

• Matthew 18 - the whole beginning of this. 1-2 "Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?" And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them.


• 6: But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for hm that a millstone were hanged about his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea."


• 10: Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones


• 19: 14 "suffer the little children and forbid them not"


• Or how about JESUS' COMMANDMENT: love one another, as I have loved you, that ye also LOVE ONE ANOTHER? (And hey, "by THIS shall ye all men know that ye are my disciples.") So, if you hate your child, or do not SHOW LOVE to your child, then clearly you cannot call yourself a follower or believer of Christ. I'm just saying.


• Matt 5:46, from the Sermon on the Mount, you know, when Jesus basically had a big church service? "For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye?"

You don't want to listen to Jesus? Just the folks after his death that liked to lay claim to knowing another man's mind? Alrighty.

• How about in Corinthians (1 Cor 13:11) when it's clear that children and men aren't the same, nor is it to be expected that they ACT the same? (When I was a child, I spake as a child, blah blah.)


• Or Titus 2:4 "teach the young women to be sober [...] to LOVE THEIR CHILDREN." picking up in 13, "looking for that blessed HOPE."


• Romans 13: 17, 19 "For the kingdom of God is [...] righteousness, and peace, and joy..." "Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another."

Or how about John, who said (I John 2: 12) "I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake."

So, okay, she wants to follow the Psalms, fine. But why not 113:9? "Be a JOYFUL mother of children?"

I can't think of much in this world that is more despicable than someone claiming their "god" wants them to treat another like shit, especially when that person is a child. If you honestly believe that your "god" has commanded you to sit a little, tender, unlearned body down and reinforce every single god damned day that they are bad, that they can never be good, that they are WRETCHED, then not only do I say fuck you, but fuck your god, the horse (donkey?) they rode in on, the man that owns the barn to shelter said beast, fuck the man that made the road, the man that raised the crops, the sandal maker, the church builder, the tithes collector, and the guy passing out palm fronds to the other wackadoo believers. And fuck you, twice as hard and as long.

And this isn't some isolated incident. If you haven't seen "Jesus Camp," then that's pretty much their M.O. Look, I'm not a Christian. I'm not a believer in any kind of supernatural being that created us, set things in motion, nada. But I get it, I get why people do. And I studied the Christian faith growing up, pretty hard core. If I can get it, why can't these people? And hasn't everyone at least HEARD of "Carrie?" I can see your dirty pillows!!

(I just found out that there are books that are VERY POPULAR that teach you to SPANK your children, because the bible says to do it - check the fifth paragraph about how sinful your kids are. I notice that everyone glosses over the "stone your son to death if he offends you" and to do it publicly, listed in Deuteronomy. Hey, let's not pick and choose, let's do all the edicts of the Bible, right? *eyerolll*)

Incidentally? Spanking DOESN'T WORK. It just makes angry children. Just thought I'd mention that, as a mother.

EVEN NED FLANDERS DIDN'T SPANK. Are you saying you're more righteous than Ned Diddly-Iddly Flanders?? (Hahahaha.)

And people wonder how I can be an atheist... Again, if you're the kind of Christian that's living your life based on the actual words of Jesus, my hat's off to you. He was a cool dude that had beautiful and loving things to say. This woman? I'd smack her about the head with her own Bible. Please note that she's a MENTAL HEALTH NURSE. Who doesn't believe in teaching children about self-esteem. Uh huh. I'm thinking she's not due for any kind of promotion. Nor should she be allowed to keep her job until she gets her thick skull examined.



Summary: "Remember, Jesus would rather constantly shame gays than let orphans have a family." ~Stephen Colbert
"We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." ~Gene Roddenberry

In the name of Jesus Christ, AMEN. ;)

Comments

[sdwolfpup.livejournal.com]

It certainly seems like a lot of Christians believe the Old Testament trumps the New. Which is really a shame; I have no problem with Jesus. I wish more people would actually be like him.

[drusplace.livejournal.com]

"I do not believe in teaching children self esteem or that they should feel good about themselves, because they should not. "

I couldn't even read the rest of what that woman wrote. Can I please help beat her with a stick? One that has nails in it? And I know what I just typed does not follow my personal beliefs (and I would never actually do it) BUT it was my gut reaction.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

I'm actually a big fan of Jesus. He said wonderful and loving things, and I still think the Beatitudes are worth living by.

How people who claim to love Jesus can forget that HE HIMSELF said that he was bringing in a higher law, meaning, his words trumped the OT... Bah.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Oh, isn't that just the most horrible thing?! The poor child is FOUR.

Gut reaction is fine. And hey, since she wants to follow the old testament style of discipline, it's only fitting that SHE be disciplined in the same manner. ;) *readies stones*

[drusplace.livejournal.com]

I feel so bad for that poor little girl. Unless she has some stable outside person telling her what she is REALLY WORTH the poor child is going to grow up with NO sense of self-worth. And there is a Baby Brother? How is HE going to turn out. This makes me want to cry with anger. And people wonder why we have problems in this world. It is because of people like THIS WOMAN!

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

There are THREE kids.

I'm reading excerpts from the book I linked to, the one that's v popular with uber-born agains and used in home schooling (spanking doesn't work hypertext)

Good lord. I do not know what is wrong with people some days, I truly do not.

[rflong.livejournal.com]

I noticed the "I am a Mental Health Nurse" but my brain cunningly left three words out of that sentence.

And dear God! The comments! How wonderful. A four year old knows she's a wretched little girl full of sin. Break out the tambourines.

Never been a fan of St. Paul. Now I recall why... Ugh.

Some people...

[furikku.livejournal.com]

I want these people to stop saying they are on my side.

I also want that T-shirt to exist. I would buy it.

Never understood the spanking thing. I was never spanked, and I turned out a lot better than some of my acquaintances who were. So, there's something, anyway.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Not a fan of Paul AT ALL. There's where a vast majority of homophobia, racism, and sexism stems from. Yay? Big fan of Jesus, not so much of a lot of his disciples.

I read the post last night, and I've not been able to stop thinking about that poor little girl. Atrocious.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

I know, right? They're giving the good Christians a bad name.

Hahaha, wouldn't that be a great T?

Spanking just makes angry and fearful children. I'm not prefect, and I've spanked my son in the past, and quickly felt horrible and sad for having given in to my own anger. There are far better (and loving) ways to discipline a child, imo.

[furikku.livejournal.com]

I've read about how it can be useful for when nothing else helps, but that's more as a quick distraction than anything.

Really, once they're old enough to be somewhat reasoned with, or at least sent to time out, I don't think there's much reason to go with body punishment. :/ It doesn't exactly promote calm thinking-over.

<-- how can you hit that?!?! *cries*

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

As a mom, and as a mom of a special needs child to boot, I've found that the best way to get through to a child is to take away something that matters to them. It's harder on the mom for the follow through aspect, but it's far more effective than just hitting your kid on their butt.

Your last line "it doesn't exactly promote calm thinking-over" is exactly right. Can you reason with a three year old? Oh, hell no. But hitting them doesn't solve anything either. UGH, people make me CRAZY!!!

Re: <-- how can you hit that?!?! *cries*

[furikku.livejournal.com]

OH MAN YES deprivation of the fun? THAT is a lasting impression. Hurting just teaches them to hurt.

(I apparently responded to a kindergarten teacher who said she'd spank me if I were her kid with, "People are not for hitting." My mom is proud of that story.)

[drusplace.livejournal.com]

:headdesk: There are THREE kids? Told you I couldn't stand to read the whole thing.

I don't know either.

[z-k.livejournal.com]

"We are born with a desire to sin. We are all born God hating and evil. "
OK.. WHAT?

..."she was a sinner, she could not control her sinful nature. She wanted to be good but she could not, instead she did things that where wrong no matter how she tried to be good. "
And this evil evil sinner is four years old? Pray tell me, what kind of sins four year olds are capable these days?

But the gem would be "She is a wretched little girl, who knows she is a wretched sinner who needs only a good saviour to help her."

OMG. What is wrong with this woman? She says she loves God, bla bla bla, but she hates her own child so much. Really Christian of her.

R

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Heck, I'M proud of you for that! What a wonderful thing to say. :)

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

There is so much wrong with this woman, you can barely find what is RIGHT.

And yeah - that word, Christian... I don't think she understands what it means. WOW.

But come on: four year olds are TOTALLY sinners. They're all about the prostitution, the murder, the selling of drugs to their play date mates... Let's be honest. ;)

[stephanierb.livejournal.com]

How people who claim to love Jesus can forget that HE HIMSELF said that he was bringing in a higher law, meaning, his words trumped the OT... Bah.

Seriously. "Turn the other cheek" pretty much negates every law regarding retribution, vengeance, etc. in the Old Testament, and yet "Christians" continually refer to the OT to justify their hateful behavior. It's appalling.

Re: R

[furikku.livejournal.com]

:D My mama raised me right!

[stephanierb.livejournal.com]

I couldn't bring myself to read the whole thing. The quotes from the text referred to in some of the comments just turned my stomach.

Count me in as someone who hates that these people give Christians a bad name. I'm torn about my faith: I was raised a Catholic and find the teachings of Jesus to be inspirational, and yet I find many "Christians" don't even follow his message. I feel that a large part of the blame should be placed on the institutions - a lot of preaching is done about the sins of homosexuality and abortion, but very little is done about love and forgiveness. Although, in all fairness, it's been a long time since I've been inside a church.

What a horrible person that woman is. Ugh.

[z-k.livejournal.com]

my thoughts exactly. Well, being inherently evil and all. Oh and when I was four, I so was mafia leader in our kindergarten. We drilled holes in bathroom walls and sold tickets. Also, the usual - drugs, whores, guns, gambling. Those were the days.

[ladypeyton.livejournal.com]

That poor poor little girl who wil grow up not understanding why she is not good enough to make her mother love her.

[anelith.livejournal.com]

That post just made me want to lay my head down on the desk and cry. For her kids, for any children they might pass along their trauma to, and for any mental health patients that might suffer under her "care." And for sheer frustration reading all the comments to her, and her response? Because all the comments saying how evil it was to treat her child this way -- and she comes right back with, "Yes, I *am* evil, we all are..."

*headdesk times a million*

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

My hope is that more Christians who feel as you do will take your religion back from the snake handlers that seem to be running the current show.

And we're agreed that the woman I linked to is just a horrible person.

[stoney321.livejournal.com]

Oh, your comment, while true, just makes my heart ache. That's exactly what will happen. :(